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ause top 97Sep18 5:14 am SIX YEARS! from Ghek the Kaldane *drum roll* On September 22, Bantoom will have been up six years.....perhaps a party next week....anyone up for it...and what evenings would be good for you.... 97Sep18 9:33 am Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader Thursday nights are good for me. 97Sep19 6:04 am Bang!! You're dead! from Hunter I'll go for Thursdays. 97Sep19 5:10 pm Party from Ghek the Kaldane And the best for me as that is my completely open night....anyone else? 97Sep19 10:45 pm Golden Jubilee from Petrouchka ONLY between the hours of 9-midnight... or before 5:30pm 97Sep20 11:03 pm Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader Cincinnati Bearcats beat Kansas Jayhawks! YeeeeeeeeeeeessssssssssBearcats 2-1! Yyyyyyeeeeeessss! I love it! ] Cansay "Upset"? 42-7 Bearcats! Yyyyyyyyeeeeeeeesssssssss! GO BEARCATS! CINCINNATI ALL THE WAY! GO UC! (University of Cincinnati) UC BEARCATS RAHRAH RAH! As you were saying, Petrouchka? 97Sep22 9:08 am Six Years from Ghek the Kaldane Happy 6th Birthday, Bantoom...... Hummm...I'm thinking Pasquales, 7:30pm on Thursday the 25th.... (Pasquales is about 100 yards East on Fair Oaks Blvd from Fair Oaks and Manzinita in Carmichael) then we can move the party somewhere else later like usual...heh...mebbie Oramin will have a lot of unexpected houseguests that evening...(The Last two years we had it at Slow Types,but he gave up the penthouse apartment he had.) If there is a change in plans I will post it on the door of Pasquales that evening... 97Sep23 7:39 am Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader That's cool, but I will need a ride. 97Sep24 10:39 pm Home of the TI99/4a from Ghek the Kaldane Kitty Cosmos and Oramin will be attending..... 97Sep24 10:42 pm Home of the TI99/4a from Ghek the Kaldane Humm....the modem was ringing but the board wasn't in auto answer mode today....probably my fault, sorry... 97Sep26 7:38 am The Sixth Anni from Ghek the Kaldane Well, we had a fun time last night at Bantoom's sixth B-day party....those who made it were :Ghek, Kitty Cosmos, Oramin and Tomcat Leader...also IQZero just happend to drop in with his volleyball team. (Lord Darkwater would have made it but he had to replace the themeostat in his car. Last time we had so few attend was at Bantooms's B-Day party at Disneyland a couple of years ago... Tomcat Leader brought his darts and we played to a draw after neither of us could hit double 1 to double off..... 97Sep26 12:14 pm Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader Thanks to ghek and Kitty for the great timeI enjoyed it a lot. Next time at darts, Ghek....:> 97Sep26 9:48 pm from Kitty Cosmos Bantoom's birthday was great! Sorry you missed us, Hunter... I *do* believe I read that you were planning to attend if it was on a Thursday. Anyway, I was once again the only lady, and this time I was surrounded by gentlemen (-; Good to see Oramin and to meet Tomcat Leader! Are we taking reservations for next year, yet? oto ew nter ngoto elp Rykor Corral> .Read global new Hafta do list 43 messages - 2 new oto ew nter ngoto elp Hafta do list] read ump ext

ause top 97Sep16 8:43 am Infobahn from Ghek the Kaldane Heh...I like the 1992 show better then the 1996 show......Jane as a french biologist (or whatever) *wolf* ...And her teenage assistant was trying to talk her into doing the centerfold of National Geographic...hilaroious...(fortunately Metrobabe taped Buffy for me when I forgot....I called six people from work trying to find someone to do it for me....no body would....*sniff*, Metrobabe said she wouldn't but she did anyway. (4 people weren't home.) 97Sep19 7:28 pm Jesus saves.. from lady hawk finish comic orders 97Sep22 9:26 am Six Years from Ghek the Kaldane Misty's Owner also tried to tape it for me, but was unable to overcome the technology involved.....hafta water the tomato tree... Quotable Quotes 76 messages - 3 new oto ew nter ngoto elp Quotable Quotes] read ump ext

ause top 97Sep01 3:47 pm 007 was elsewhere from Ghek the Kaldane "...My car looks like swiss cheeze..." - Die Hard 97Sep22 10:26 am Six Years from Ghek the Kaldane "We came, we saw, we made a great BBS!" -Ghek 97Sep23 7:42 am Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader "I'm laughing at the superior intellect." Kirk in Star Trek II, The wrath of Khan. 97Sep24 6:50 am Home of the TI99/4a from Ghek the Kaldane Buffy: Am I ever going to live down that dance with Xander? Willow+: "NEVER" IBM Share [The Gridley Wave] 100 messages - 31 new oto ew nter ngoto elp IBM Share: read ump ext

ause top 97Sep18 4:46 am movin' N shakin' from Ghek the Kaldane @ Bantoom _ Sac-CA Ordered a Scanrom4e from PcZone a week ago....I wonder where it is....have to check....(anyone else get one?) - Drumming fingers in Carmichael 97Sep19 04:34 from Jetrock @ ECBBS Jim: You've got it right--Nx means the CDROM drive spins N times faster than a regular CD. And faster CDROM drives typically have faster access times, due to better-quality head-repositioning hardware, which allows the head to scoot about faster... 97Sep19 07:32 from Freddy @ ECBBS I think he asked about the trasnfer rate, which doesn't change (unless you have SCSI, then it's hella fast!!!) 97Sep19 10:37 from Curly Surmudgeon @ ECBBS You think wrong. Jets gave a correct answer. 97Sep19 18:40 from Freddy @ ECBBS Hmmm. Wrong am I? Or are you blind? Jim Earl on 97Sep18 at 14:56 says the following "Does that mean they transfer data 24x faster than a 1x drive, and if so, does that mean the platter spins 24x faster?" Freddy replied on 97Sep19 at 07:32 with the following "I think he asked about the transfer rate, which doesn't change (unless you have SCSI and then it's hella fast!!!)" Curly then said on 97Sep19 at 10:37 "You think wrong. Jets gave a correct answer." Fact is he may have given a correct answer, just not to Jim's question. 97Sep20 12:02 from Freddy @ ECBBS The number is not the transfer rate...it's the spin rate. It's how fast the cd is actually turning. It's not how fast the data transfers to your computer. That's why the newer CD-rom's are having two rates on them like a 10-24, basically the outside spins the fastest, so that's the highest spin rate you can have. Which is funny, because when you burn a CD, I believe it burns from the inside out, but it seems it'd be more effiecent to burn from the outside in...at least as far as read speed. 97Sep20 13:28 from Jetrock @ ECBBS I didn't say the number is the transfer rate, but transfer rate goes up as the spin rate goes up--but it's not necessarily a linear relationship. And CD's are not like record players, which maintain a constant speed: the rotation speed varies by head position, so the velocity of the CD past the head is a constant regardless of head position. This is why CD speeds are expressed in multiples rather than a rotation speed in RPM: the RPM of the disk varies inversely with the tracking radius. 97Sep20 14:26 from Freddy @ ECBBS "The velocity of the CD past the head is a constant regardless of head position." ??? Hmmm. Are you saying that if the head is at the inside track of a cd that the speed at the farthest track out is running the same speed? Also, the transfer rate is not what increases it's the read rate. That's what the number represents. 1 spin (1x), 12 spin (12x)...not 1 transfer rate (1x) 12 transfer rate (12x). You'd be saying that a 24 spin cdrom is 24 times more effiecient then a 1x, which isn't true. My 4x scsi cd-rom is more then enough for any aplication out there. I haven't played anything that will even make it lag. That is because of the transfer rate. 4 spin is fast enough, just IDE transfer rate is much slower then SCSI. 97Sep20 18:05 from Atomic Skull @ ECBBS Jetrock: The source code for Lightwave on Intel and Lightwave on the Mac is about 95% the same.. The only difference is in the graphics and 3-d hardware API's You make your code modular, the main "guts" of the program can remain the same.. All you have to do is write interface code to hook the app into the OS's functions, then compile. 97Sep20 19:40 from Jetrock @ ECBBS Yes, the velocity of the CD past the head is constant regardless of head position. It's the same velocity if the head is closest to the hub of the cd or if the head is closest to the edge. How? Because the CD-ROM drive spins much faster when the head is near the center, and slower when the head is near the hub. It's an inversely proportional relationship. And there's only one "track" on a CD-ROM, it's a spiral track like on a vinyl record. And I KNOW the transfer rate is not what increases the read rate, the transfer rate is an expression of the rate at which data is read. Roughly speaking, spin speed of CD-ROM drive X standard CD-ROM transfer speed = transfer rate. And yes, SCSI transfer rate is much faster than IDE transfer rate for CD-ROMs, because most IDE CD-ROMs use Mode 0 IDE which is kinda pokey. But an 8x SCSI CD-ROM would have a faster total transfer rate than a 4x SCSI CD-ROM... 97Sep20 21:53 from Jim Earl @ ECBBS So if I'm going to buy me a new SCSI CDROM, what "speed" should I get? And will it still be able to play audio CD's? Do audio CD's do that same "change speed depending on the location of the head" thing? 97Sep20 23:13 from Atomic Skull @ ECBBS Jetrock: But that's a pretty small difference, and you make the interface between the main body of the program and the OS interface modules standardized.. Then porting is quite simple.. Just write a set of "drivers" for the OS that gets added to the source. 97Sep20 23:18 from Atomic Skull @ ECBBS As I understand it, the main thing that held up MacLightwave was QuickDraw 3-D support, QuickDraw 3-d is almost as bad as Direct 3-D.. Jesus, why can't Apple support Open-GL like every other Os under the sun? 97Sep21 11:37 from Nexus @ ECBBS I was looking at CD-ROMs the other day, which would be better, a 24X IDE or a 15X SCSI hooked to an ISA SCSI card? 97Sep21 12:32 from Jetrock @ ECBBS Jim Earl: SCSI CD-ROMs tend to be faster than IDE CD-ROMs of the same speed: the throughput capability of the CD-ROM devices may be the same, but SCSI can better manage the signal, so you get better performance. The internal mechanics of a SCSI CD-ROM drive are no different than an IDE CD-ROM drive. And yes, they'll play audio CD's. And yeah, audio CD's are also CLV (constant linear velocity) devices. AS: Yes, it is a pretty small difference. Modify some code and recompile. I'm sorry if I gave the impression that you had to chuck all your source code and start again from scratch to port a program from one platform to another. Basically, as AS is making clearer, you just rewrite the interface stuff and recompile. It's not a major rewrite--but it's not 100% identical code, either. Nexus: Um, that's not a really clear question. What would the 24x IDE CD-ROM be hooked up to? If it's a 16-bit IDE/ISA card, then the 15x may well give better performance. But a 32-bit PCI connection might mean better performance from the 24x... unless you know all the factors in the equation (including the manufacturer of the CD-ROM) it's kinda hard to tell... 97Sep21 13:46 from Freddy @ ECBBS Jetrock, you seem really smart. Answer this for me please... What is the transfer rate of 4x scsi cdrom and the transfer rate of an 8x scsi cdrom? Just curious. You seem to know exactly what you are talking about. 97Sep21 16:31 from Freddy @ ECBBS Just kidding. My whole point is that IDE trasnfer rate is much slower then a SCSI transfer rate. Also, that a cd's rate is not a constant. It's variable. That's why the newer cd-rom's are advertised with two numbers instead of the one that was happening previously. Like a 10x-24x cdrom. There is no sustained 24spin read. That's a maximum. 97Sep21 19:01 from Jetrock @ ECBBS Well, yeah, transfer rates are never a constant, freddy. Finding the exact transfer rate of one CD-ROM drive or another is a job for a nice benchmarking program, because they tend to vary, depending on specific make & model, cache size, interface, etcetera. And which IDE to which SCSI are we talking about here? Mode 5 IDE via a PCI bus is certainly faster than a 16-bit SCSI-1 interface. All things being equal, yeah, you do tend to get better performance with SCSI. Re performance specs: Typically, when you're reading the ads, they'll list the highest possible transfer rate, and if you dig farther (things like product reviews and benchmarks) you can find the routine transfer rate. There isn't much point in labeling a CD-ROM "10x-24x" though. Just because a car has a maximum speed of 120 MPH doesn't mean it will always travel at that rate, it's a maximum--and it'd be silly to return a car with that top speed just because you went driving in it and it was capable of traveling at less than 120 MPH... And, finally, where do you find these CD-ROMs labeled "10x-24x"? I've got the latest MicroTimes in front of me and went hunting for so-labeled devices and I can't find any listed... where did you see these strange beasties? 97Sep22 01:18 from Nexus @ ECBBS It would be the 24X IDE going into the Secondary IDE controller on the MB versus a 15X SCSI going into an Adaptec AVA-1515 ISA SCSI controller, which is used just for my Zip drive right now. I'd have to look into it more to see what mode the IDE is, but basicly it's a toss-up? 97Sep22 9:39 am Six Years from Ghek the Kaldane @ Bantoom _ Sac-CA (Today is Bantoom's Sixth Birthday) UPS just dropped off my Scanrom4e....PCZone had negleted to write down my apartment number which delayed delivery by a week...(Tiger Direct now has it $20 cheaper than what I paid)... 97Sep22 12:25 pm Newsflash! from.... from Nightwind @ Bantoom _ Sac-CA Well, one factor that is being overlooked is that a 15X SCSI cdrom running off a ISA card probably couln't get full throughput. The card itself would be a bottleneck, I suspect. Given a VESA or PCI harddrive controller the 24X IDE would almost definitely be a better choice for speed (even given SCSI tending to be faster par for par. Nexus: DUH!!! Your looking at cdrom writables. first labeled 2X/4X. Latest I've seen is a 6X/8X (Could be faster by now.) One speed is the writing speed, the other is the reading speed. Look at little closer at the ad next time. Typicallty run 2 to 3 times the cost of read only models. That would be your first clue. 97Sep23 07:37 from Freddy @ ECBBS Acttually, yes, there is a good description by them about their 12x-20x. Basically, the data is spread out on the outer track. It's the same amount of data, just spread out. So, when the head gets to the outside track the head speeds up to read it. Hmm. Guess you were wrong Jetrock. It's one of the first cd-rom's to actually label the truth. Basically, the reason for the same amount of data on the outside track, instead of keeping it evenly spaced out and cramming more in, is for audio play. (which is a waste) Also, if you still have a record player. Play a record. Glue an icon representing me on the outside edge of the record, and then glue an icon representing you on the inside edge. Then play it (at any speed). I'll be moving much faster then you. Heh. But, cd's speed up to read the outside track. Basically, a head reads data at the same speed, but the data gets spaced out the farther you go to the outside edge of a cd, so it has to speed up to read the same amount of data. Hence, the reason behind all cd's being burned from the inside out. 97Sep23 09:54 from Jetrock @ ECBBS Um, no, Freddy. Hard drives and floppy disks are arranged in basically that way (sectors are spread out as you get closer to the edge of the disc surface), but CD's aren't. For starters, a CD has *one* "track", a spiral from the inside edge of the CD to the outside edge. So talking about the "outside track" is silly since it's the same track as the "inside track". Because of this spiral track, information is stored with a constant density throughout the CD's data path--which means, yes, there is more information in the outside edges than on the inside edges, because of the greater radius of the growing spiral track. And yes, a record's outside edge spins faster than its inside edge, for a given constant speed. But CD's don't work like record players. As the head moves around on the surface of the CD, it accelerates during play so that the speed of the CD under the head remains a constant--Constant Linear Velocity. You're getting hard drives and CD-ROMs mixed up: hard drives spin at constant speed, and their sectors are more spaced out as you move towards the outside track, so there is no change in speed needed and data read rate remains about the same. In CD-ROMs, the outer sectors take up the same space as the inner sectors, but the rate of rotation changes to compensate. And since the difference in inner-edge and outer-edge speed is a ratio of about 2.6, if your theory held true it'd be a 7.7/20, not a 12/20 speed drive. Go read Plextor's web page, Freddy. Maybe you'll begin to understand what's going on here. 97Sep23 12:15 from Freddy @ ECBBS Hmmm.. I just read the Plextor ad yesterday. It said just what I said. Basically the data is read at a constant rate (CLV), but the data is more spread out at the outside of a cd (since outside track is confusing you). This is to accomadate audio cd's. Basically the disk needs to spin faster to read the same amount of information the farther out on the cd it goes (from the center). I think you have your information backwards. HD's don't read at a CLV. The data is all the same size per block. There is a magazine on cd-r's describing dvd and cdrom and cdwritable. I'd check it out and then get back to me. Or just reread the Plextor page, because this article was talking about the 12x-20x and explaining how nice it is to see a company show the actually spin rates. Also, this article was explaining how data never really gets past 12x transfer. (which I think is supposed to be 1.8megs right?). I've seen a little faster data transmission, but nothing near 3.6, which would be a 24x, right? I think if they can get away from the audio playing of cd's. Change the format so that the outside track had much more information on it (also making the cd storage capacity higher), it'd be cool. Oh, this mag was also explaining how there are going to be some much faster cd-roms coming out...I think they were talking over 30x. Very cool. Also, they were explaining how most of the dvd players coming out are going to be capable of reading cd's and most cd writables. I guess they use two different heads for this. 97Sep23 13:45 from Jetrock @ ECBBS Um, Freddy, I said that hard drives don't read at a CLV, they have a constant spin rate. But because the sectors are farther apart at the outer cylinders, they have a constant read rate. Basically, sectors on a hard drive are arranged like spokes in a wheel--they extend radially from the center of the diskette to the outer edge, and tracks are laid out in concentric circles around the center of the diskette. If you try this on a piece of paper (first draw a circle and mark the center point, then draw a number of "spokes" from the center to the outer edge, then a number of concentric circles from the inside to the outside) you'll notice that, even if you keep the difference of the concentric circles' radii constant and the degrees between the spokes constant, that the "sectors" on the outer edge are larger than the "sectors" on the inner edge. But you will note that if you spin such a widget, that you pass every "spoke" at a constant rate--once per rotation of the circle. By placing disk sectors in this manner, one can obtain a consistent tracking ability with a constant spin rate. The outer sectors are larger, but hold the same amount of information as the inner sectors. "There is a magazine on..." Um, I don't suppose you know the name and date of the magazine? If you want me to check it out, fine, but it would certainly help if you mentioned what issue of what magazine you want me to look at. And I read the Plextor web page, and the reviews, and yes, CD-ROMs don't always read at their rated transfer rate, but not for the reasons you describe. 97Sep23 21:16 from JoePhoto @ ECBBS I could be wrong; but I think the variable speed CD's are NEW; I think the older ones turn at a constant speed. 97Sep23 22:51 from Jetrock @ ECBBS um, no, joe, *all*CD-ROMs are constant-linear-velocity devices, and all audio CD's as well. They turn more slowly when the read head is nearest the outer edge, so linear velocity remains constant. 97Sep23 23:03 from Freddy @ ECBBS Heh. I'm not even going to read the posts after mine. I made a mistake, and I fess up to it. I went back and reread the article (it's in the magazine emedia...very cool mag about cd-roms, cd-writables, and dvds). Basically, I had it backwards. I browsed it last night and then only had a minute to post (on my lunch), so I apologize to you jetrock. You were right and I was wrong. Heh. I'm a big man, but not too big as not to apologize to the little people out there. 97Sep23 23:07 from Freddy @ ECBBS Heh. Ok, now I've read the posts. You still are right, Jetrock. Except you thought I wouldn't give you the title of a magazine. First, what a twit for thinking like a two year old (I know you are but what am I mentality). I had read an article in passing, basically while drinking a cup of coffee and it just happened to be at my table. Jeesh. But, I did go back and reread it (had to find it which was the hard thing, since I didn't know the title). It was the last one. Then I had to find the damn article. One of the cool things in the article was the DVD comments. Basically, right now about 80-90% of cd-roms can read cd writables acurately. DVD can't. Unless they add another head. Sony and Samsung (I believe) are two manufacturers making DVD readers with two heads. Applause to Sony! They didn't say which cd-roms had a better acuracy or which media was the best (two things I was looking for) on the burners. Anyone finds this out and there is a cookie in it for you (and no, I don't work for microsoft). 97Sep24 00:39 from JoePhoto @ ECBBS But I honestly think I DID read of some NEW technology that produces specs with the dual rates; (as in 12X-24X).... I did not read the article but remember them saying it was something new..... !!! 97Sep25 01:52 from Jetrock @ ECBBS in a bookstore? i thought you were having a cup of coffee and it was at your table? was it one of those coffeeshop/bookstore thingies? 97Sep26 01:22 from hank @ ECBBS gee, Fred, you described what any store would do... Ordering with no charge or obligation and sampling media in-store... That's hardly anything special. EIB/Local Politics 100 messages - 21 new oto ew nter ngoto elp EIB/Local Politics: read ump ext

ause top 97Sep18 4:50 am movin' N shakin' from Ghek the Kaldane @ Bantoom _ Sac-CA Health Benifits aren't taxed.........perhaps they should be.... 97Sep18 20:24 from Freddy @ ECBBS I believe that the govt is the biggest business in the US. It is also the one who makes the most, and has the biggest salary spending. Talk about cutting pork and you have to get those people to quit their koosh govt jobs (and remember that they are union). 97Sep18 23:34 from sinner @ ECBBS quit your job in protest against the man, then. hey, ever movement starts with an individual, dude. walk out, tommorrow. if you don't, you're talkin' out your ass. 97Sep19 00:30 from Freddy @ ECBBS I don't work at the state? I work at HP. 97Sep19 5:15 pm Party from Ghek the Kaldane @ Bantoom _ Sac-CA I was a civil servant once.....I resented having to join the union....but it was cool getting raises from the President..... 97Sep19 04:40 from Jetrock @ ECBBS Freddy: Yeah, and the biggest beneficiaries of that bloated government are the big corporations, especially high-tech industry. Slash it like crazy, I say. Union government employee, Screw 'em, the department of such & such is closing. Here, go agitate at that factory and unionize the workers, there's a good lad. You may be under the impression that I'm a 'tax & spend liberal'. It may frighten you to realize that I consider myself to be a FISCAL CONSERVATIVE. My methods of application are different than most, though--I think we need to get public money out of private industry in order to prevent subsidy's negative and deleterious effects on the business market. Most high-tech industry would collapse overnight without subsidies. Nuclear power still isn't profitable without massive federal support. Screw 'em, if they can't pull their own weight they deserve to die. Make those lazy corporate-welfare jerks get real jobs! Go start a day-care center or help set up a neighborhood health clinic, we've had enough freeloading from the likes of the timber industry, cattle ranchers, an mining companies! 97Sep19 07:36 from Freddy @ ECBBS Yeah, I hear we dump all the tax money into Intel and HP. Tell em to make mroe stuff. Also, we Dump the rest into Coors and Miller. Who the hell are you? How old are you? 97Sep19 14:42 from Jetrock @ ECBBS I'm Jetrock. I'm 28. And I've studied a lot of this stuff, Freddy. Unlike you, I consider research and analysis to be more worthwhile than making up statistics off the top of my head. If you want I can provide concrete examples of corporate subsidies that make up "wealthfare"... 97Sep19 18:49 from Freddy @ ECBBS Make up stats? Jetrock, do you still live at home with Mommy? Cause you act like it. I've lived. That means I've traveled all over the US (and some of Mexico) and I've worked at many jobs, actually just about all of them. Hell, I even worked at Taco Bell (ok, so it was only 12 hours before I quit, but I *did* work there). Point is you have no experience to draw from so you feel more comfortable quoting "sources." Well, if you have taken any advanced college English (actually, just about any English class, but I figure you didn't pay attention in HS) you'll know that a "source" is more then a book. It can be anything, including an experience you had. Yes, you could be a source. If you talked to a guy on the street, he could be a "source." I've told you things I've experienced and you say they aren't true. Who's making stuff up here? They guy who speaks from experience, or the guy that says the other is lieing. 97Sep19 20:09 from Jetrock @ ECBBS Um, okay, Freddy, there are "sources" other than books, but I don't consider your imagination to be a credible "source". And if YOU paid attention in college, you'd know that some sources are better than others--and sources which are verifiable (meaning you can look them up) which can be double-checked and verified from multiple references are far more reliable sources than hearsay, word-of-mouth, or third-party sources. But then again, perhaps you weren't able to get into college... 97Sep20 12:10 from Freddy @ ECBBS Bah, Jetrock is officially an idiot. Imagination. Talk about closed mind. Jetrock, if you are too close minded to listen to another without personally saying he is lieing then you should not be allowed to post or even have opinions. Basically, you are stating that anything anyone posts that disgarees with your own post is made up and imaginary. Very childish. 97Sep20 14:32 from Freddy @ ECBBS Heh. Nah, haven't seen you say anything beside "you're wrong". You still can't make an intelligent point on econ or politics without backtracking and saying that you made a mistake in your previous post. 97Sep20 19:46 from Jetrock @ ECBBS The mistakes involved have been in others' perceptions of what I'm saying, Freddy. I'm not responsible for how you perceive my words, and if it appears that my words are misunderstood then I attempt to clarify. 97Sep21 02:05 from sinner @ ECBBS sorry, Fred...but i think the opinion of most here in that it is YOU that is the fool. sure, everybody...including me...screws up every once and a while. but not with your consistency.....or vigor. :-P 97Sep21 13:49 from Freddy @ ECBBS Nah, I don't screw up. Many just seem to have dissenting views from my own, and instead of accepting or even listening to them state that they are wrong. 97Sep21 15:10 from JoePhoto @ ECBBS Irezumi; I, of course, had noticed your infallability.... (But then what do I know ??? ) 97Sep21 15:27 from Orca @ ECBBS Annoy a democrat: Work hard and be happy 97Sep21 16:15 from Freddy @ ECBBS HEh. 97Sep22 9:44 am Six Years from Ghek the Kaldane @ Bantoom _ Sac-CA Heh....I worked at Computer Warehouse for 3 days.....then I was raised from the dead and cast out.... 97Sep23 23:27 from Freddy @ ECBBS Heh. I hate to admit it, but I bought a system from them a number of years back. Then when I had a problem, some indian jumped on the phone and started cussing me out and telling me to go to hell. Nice store. 97Sep24 00:43 from JoePhoto @ ECBBS I noticed that one of the Democrats on one of the Sunday news shows; BACKTRACKED and appologized for implying that Reagan had made fundraising calls from the WhiteHouse.... he says that all that apparently happened is that he may have called some PAST donors to "Thank" them.... but he said he did not intend to imply that Reagan had solicited illegal funds. 97Sep24 07:22 from Freddy @ ECBBS He was also the owner (in my previous post). Lazer Tag [Warriors Gate] 100 messages - 9 new oto ew nter ngoto elp Lazer Tag] read ump ext

ause top 97Sep16 9:04 am Infobahn from Ghek the Kaldane Lazer Force Games for Wed Sept 10th... Game 1:Team 3 (4:17pm) 1st out of 13 (Yellow team - 1st) Score Hit% Lvl Fired Hit For Against Ghek 13,294 30 5 521 159 0 (all: 32) Dragon = 0 Petrouchka 12,804 20 6 853 176 1 1 [Teamate! 2nd of 13] Trident 10,874 23 1 304 72 16 8 [not a member-green] MonkeyBoyVIP 9,094 42 6 195 83 13 11 [top player - red] Monkey Boy was using us for missle practice I think...with ten level ones it was a real firefight...free game for me! Game2:Team 3 (5:05pm) 3rd out of 13 (Yellow team -1st by 150 points!) MoolightKngt15,094 47 6 383 181 14 6 [Red - me=missile bait] Lucky 7 14,124 57 5 202 116 6 6 [Green - bait again!] Ghek 13,354 24 5 595 146 0 (all:25) Dragon = 0 Petrouchka 9,283 17 6 696 120 1 1 [Yellow - teamate!] Moonlight Knight and Lucky 7 were using reset and missiling us while we were dead...very nasty combo....MK tends to follow people and everybody will be out to make his life miserable...Lucky 7 is cool. Game3:Team3 (7:47pm) 1st out of 13 (Green Team - 2nd) Ghek 9,784 21 5 412 89 0 (all:52) Dragon = 3 Starkiller 9,354 21 6 413 90 8 9 [Yellow - often play] Jensen(4th) 6,124 11 3 292 34 8 4 [Red - LF mascot] This was a fun and strange game...it had to be restarted when one of the packs was overcharging from a battery and when you died, you stayed dead. Starkiller (we have competed a lot) was very kind and mid-game, when he found out that I had never missiled anyone, let me missile him...it took me 4 tries to get it right...and I beat him by less than a missiles worth! Jensen (Jensen 13 on the internet) is the young teen female "mascot" at Lazer Force...Its funny when her mom calls and she has to go home. Her team, Red, won in terms of teams. Game 4:Individual Supercharge (9:03pm) 3rd out of 7 Franswa VIP 17,154 20 6 734 153 25 24 [best player - LF top 3] Lore 14,734 11 1 806 96 20 16 [smart alec kid] Ghek 12,555 19 5 549 109 0 (all:75) Dragon = 2 Renton F.C. 9,484 27 5 325 88 13 16 [sniper?] Stingray 8,122 12 1 413 52 11 9 [Lore's mom] Hammer 6,815 16 6 235 39 12 6 [new 6, got run over] Zon Kaarna 6,581 16 6 178 29 12 2 [House shill/target] A fun and wild game, Franswa was missiling me and others, and Lore was running over us at point blank range, when he gets to level 2 and I only have to hit him twice, I am gonna cream him, he is not near as good as he thinks he is. Renton was sniping me the whole time, I figure, 'cause I never saw him close. See ya Wed at 7:30...or so...when Petrock wants to play early, I am there but I come back later at the regular time. 97Sep19 5:13 pm Party from Ghek the Kaldane Just drove past Lazer Force and noticed Petrochka's car there...he's double dipping this week.... Coupons for Lazer Force: Just got back from Lucky's at Fair Oaks and Marconi.....the recipt has a 1 free with 1 paid at Lazer Force coupon on the back.. Princess Buttercup (owner) told me that there would be coupons in this weeks Sacramento News and Review.... 97Sep19 10:47 pm Cavalier Images from Petrouchka I'm highly annoyed with LF. 97Sep20 6:06 am Bang!! You're dead! from Hunter Wh7 y? 97Sep22 9:47 am Six Years from Ghek the Kaldane Actually it seems to be just an add in Scaramento News and Review.....as if I didn't have enough to settle with Princess Buttercup.....But I will be shopping more at luckys and checking the trash barrel outside.....2 for 1's you know... 97Sep22 9:51 am Six Years from Ghek the Kaldane Lazer Force Games for Wed September 17, 1997. Game 1:Team 3 (6:55pm) 13th out of 17 - Red Team Wins (Mine) Handle Score Hit% lvl Shots Hits Yay Ouch 1 Rooty BPIMP 12,094 27 6 338 93 1 0 Red - Teamate! 2 P ButtercupVIP 11,434 25 6 392 100 2 3 Green - owner 3 Sassy 10,374 20 5 546 112 1 3 Yellow - astmgr 4 Black Hawk 10,044 9 1 712 66 6 14 Green - feud 5 Butterfly VIP 9,314 25 3 264 66 4 7 Yellow - smarine 6 Obi-Wan 9,233 13 1 489 13 1 0 Red - Teamate! 13 Ghek Kaldane 5,883 18 5 322 59 0 (56) Dragon = 1 RED 15 Alien 5,062 27 6 133 36 4 2 Green - shill 17 Petrochka 3,561 14 6 328 49 4 0 Green - badgun Originally I and Petrock were going to hunt down Black Hawk as a team...but then they spit us up (Black Hawk breaks the rules by following people and shooting them unmercifully.) and slid in some space marine ringers at the last minute...so Yellow and Green teams had space marine buddies working as a team, and all I had was a little help from Obi-Wan...(and a 20 second slice of help from Alien [marshal/shill Green] when I was surrounded and trying to take a target) The fog machine had just been fixed and they cranked it up so that long distance shooting was out, so everywhere I went, I was nose to nose with level 1's or entrenched space marine teamates. Petrocks gun was trashed so he got toasted even worse than I did. Ok, so I am whining..worst score in many weeks. Game 2: Team 3 (7:30pm) 4th out of 15, Green Team Won by 52 points. Handle Score Hit% APH lvl Shots Hits Yay Ouch 1 Petrouchka 11,804 14 59 6 1017 145 0 1 RED - Teamate! 2 P ButtercupVIP 11,014 28 63 6 429 123 6 9 Green - owneret 3 Cosmo VIP 9,604 13 60 6 763 105 5 11 Green - smarinet 4 Ghek De Kaldane 9,134 16 79 5 473 77 0 (42) Dragon = 1 RED 5 Obi-wan 8,584 12 109 1 439 54 2oops0 RED - teamate! 6 Sassy VIP 8,244 27 85 5 222 62 3 6 Yellow - astmgret 7 P Va 7,814 25 67 5 276 69 6 2 Green 8 Butterfly VIP 7,544 28 89 3 181 52 5 5 Yellow - smarinet (APH is Adjusted Average Points Per Hit, a statistic I am checking...in game 1 it was 58 for me.) Petrock was going to tear up his card if he did poorly in this one...no worries about that! Red had good teamwork to stand aginst the space marines but I was often off by myself, but with some covering fire! Early on, Princess Buttercup was snipeing me on the lower level and I went after her, one on one I tagged her 4 times in a row in a roving hunt...proved my point and moved on. It was a blast of a game... Petrock, what does Rooty's handle stand for again? (formerly known as Rutebagaboy....back when we couldn't stand him...) 97Sep22 10:10 am Six Years from Ghek the Kaldane An ajustment for the APH.....LAPH (Level Adjusted Average Points Per Hit would be to add 10 points to your avearge for each level over 1.....this simulates everybody being level one in performance....Sassy (125) , and I (119) would be the top performers then. The APH formula itself is : (Score - (targets * 1000 [or 800 in indi games])) / (hits - (targets * 3)) [targets of course being the last digit of your score] This gives performance oriented people a way to compare scores. I will check it against a few more games to see if it reads true. 97Sep24 10:41 pm Home of the TI99/4a from Ghek the Kaldane Stopped by Luckys tonight after Lazer Force....picked up 4 more 2 for 1 coupons.....heh...you could too.... 97Sep24 10:47 pm Cavalier Images from Petrouchka Rooty B-P.I.M.P. Pretty Impressive Masculine Proportions... or, as I tweaked it... Pretty insignificant miniscule penis. 97Sep24 10:48 pm Cavalier Images from Petrouchka As of now, Petrouchka is officially retired from Lazer Force. Buffy's Soundgarten [Temple Gardens] 5 messages - 1 new oto ew nter ngoto elp Buffy's Soundgarten] read ump ext

ause top 97Sep18 5:09 am from Asgard File "B_party.wav" uploaded by Ghek the Kaldane: Desc: Buffy the Vampire Slayer - Buffy:"We saved the world...I say we party!" Ghek 97Sep22 10:25 am from Asgard File "W_boylik.wav" uploaded by Ghek the Kaldane: Desc: Buffy the Vampire Slayers' Willow on meeting guys she likes "...can only speak in monosylables....and then I just have to go away..." cain't remember how it goes one of her most hilarous speeches. Word Association 100 messages - 9 new oto ew nter ngoto elp Word Association> read ump ext

ause top 97Sep18 4:51 am movin' N shakin' from Ghek the Kaldane ...with mustard 97Sep18 10:16 am Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader And an olive on top. 97Sep19 5:16 pm Party from Ghek the Kaldane cherry 97Sep19 7:30 pm Jesus saves.. from lady hawk ..pop 97Sep20 12:04 pm Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader Soda... 97Sep21 6:45 pm Newsflash! from.... from Nightwind Cracker 97Sep22 10:13 am Six Years from Ghek the Kaldane Ice 97Sep22 12:31 pm Newsflash! from.... from Nightwind Breaker 97Sep24 7:00 am Infobahn from Ghek the Kaldane wall to wall 97Sep25 8:24 am Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader Carpeting..... Sports Haven 100 messages - 10 new oto ew nter ngoto elp Sports Haven> read ump ext

ause top 97Sep18 4:52 am movin' N shakin' from Ghek the Kaldane And Thats the way it was.....[insert Turtle Wax commercial] 97Sep18 10:23 am Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader Cheers to Curt Schilling of the Phiuesday night he got 300 strikeouts for the season and had a perfect game going through 8 innings. He finished with 305 strikeouts and a win. Nice guys DO finish first sometimes after all. Jeers to the Philadelphia Eagles for literally blowing the game Monday night against Dallas. They had the game all wrapped up and they fumbled the field goal. How do you blow a gam? Let me count the ways..... 97Sep19 5:16 pm Party from Ghek the Kaldane Could it be radon from artifical turf? 97Sep19 10:49 pm Cavalier Images from Petrouchka Hmmm... Seems to be that I got EVERY GAME RIGHT last week. 97Sep19 10:50 pm Cavalier Images from Petrouchka LAST WEEK: 13 right, 0 wrong. *obsequious bow* SO FAR THIS SEASON: 19 right, 9 wrong. 97Sep19 11:03 pm Cavalier Images from Petrouchka PICKS FOR THE WEEK OF SUNDAY, SEP 21st 1. Minnesota Vikings at Green Bay Packers Summary: Minnesota is surprising, and Green Bay looks VERY beatable. But you'd have to be NUTS to go against the Pack at Lambeau Field. THE PICK: Green Bay 2. Kansas City Chiefs at Carolina Panthers Summary: The home team wins this game, whether it be in Charlotte of Kansas City. THE PICK: Carolina 3. Chicago Bears at New England Patriots Summary: Super Bowl XX, Jan. 1986, result - Chicago 46, N.E. 10. This Sunday's result - N.E. 46, Chicago 10 THE PICK: New England 4. Detroit Lions at New Orleans Saints Summary: The Saints suck. THE PICK: Detroit 5. Baltimore Ravens at Tennessee Oilers Summary: Good game. But the Ravens are on a roll. THE PICK: Baltimore 6. Oakland Raiders at New York Jets Summary: C'mon. The overrated Raiders struggled with the Falcons, of all teams, last week. THE PICK: New York Jets 7. Atlanta Falcons at San Francisco 49ers Summary: Ya know, any other division in the NFL, and the Niners are cellar-dwellers... but, as it stands... THE PICK: San Francisco 8. Cincinnati Bengals at Denver Broncos Summary: Attention Denver - proceed directly to the AFC Championship game. Do not sweat. Do not pass Go. THE PICK: Denver 9. Indianapolis Colts at Buffalo Bills Summary: Here's where the favored Bills show how far they've fallen. THE PICK: Indianapolis 10. San Diego Chargers at Seattle Seahawks Summary: A doomed-to-fail team at an under-achieving team. Great. THE PICK: Seattle 11. New York Giants at St. Louis Rams Summary: Here's where the Rams' coaching experience pays off. THE PICK: St. Louis 12. Miami Dolphins at Tampa Bay Buccaneers Summary: Two over-achievers. But Tampa Bay has talent, whereas Miami is running on luck. THE PICK: Tampa Bay 13. Pittsburgh Steelers at Jacksonville Jaguars Summary: Brunnell? Who? THE PICK: Jacksonville Off this week: NFC EAST (except the N.Y. Giants) Dallas Cowboys Philadelphia Eagles Arizona Cardinals Washington Redskins 97Sep20 12:15 pm Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader Okay, I'm alittle more modest about my record. so with that in mind, here we go. 1)The Pack. No brainer. 2)KC. On a roll. 3)Patriots. Again, no brainer. 4)Detroit. Upset, due to Barry Snders. 5)Oilers. Home field advantage. 6)Jets. Surprise time, not to mention revenge. 7)Denver. i don't like it, but they're gone in the first round. 8)buffalo. there's still some ammo in the old gun yet. 9)San diego. They WILL succeed. 10)Giants. Showtime or no go time. 11)Dolphins. Marino all the way. 12) steelers. It's Monday night y'all. There you have it. Updates and highlights Monday. 97Sep22 10:17 am Six Years from Ghek the Kaldane Ghek gives the tomahawk chop... 97Sep23 7:51 am Pass Interference from Tomcat Leader Oh, great. Another Braves fan. ;> Surprise games from the weekend: Buffalo, NY Jets, New Orleans(!). No Brainers of the week: SF, K, Denver. Cheers to the Jets for overcoming the Raiders. Jeers to Miami, I expeced a better game than what I witnessed, guys. Much better. 97Sep24 10:52 pm Cavalier Images from Petrouchka Yet another successful week. LAST WEEK: 10 right, 3 wrong. SEASON TOTAL: 29 right, 12 wrong. I would have been 11 and 2 last week, but Indianapolis got SCREWED in their game... 97Sep24 11:23 pm Cavalier Images from Petrouchka PETROUCHKA'S PICKS (for Sept. 28th and 29th) 1. Green Bay Packers at Detroit Lions Detroit still has a few years before they're a threat to the Green & Gold THE PICK: Green Bay 2. Jacksonville Jaguars at Washington Redskins The Jags are the Rodney Dangerfield of the NFL. They just "can't get no respect." Washington is favored in this game? HAH. THE PICK: Jacksonville 3. Tennessee Oilers at Pittsburgh Steelers Just how good are the Oilers? Just how much has Pittsburgh fallen? THE PICK: Pittsburgh 4. Denver Broncos at Atlanta Falcons Hah! Hahahahah! Hehehehe. THE PICK: Denver 5. New Orleans Saints at New York Giants Quote Ditka: "Our goal is to win one game this year" Okay. You did. THE PICK: New York Giants 6. Arizona Cardinals at Tampa Bay Buccaneers Try this on for size: Houlihan Stadium becomes a feared place to play. THE PICK: Tampa Bay 7. Chicago Bears at Dallas Cowboys The Cowboys have struggled with mediocre opponents. This should end. THE PICK: Dallas 8. Seattle Seahawks at Kansas City Chiefs Hmmm. Air Schottenheimer isn't that bad after all THE PICK: Kansas City 9. Baltimore Ravens at San Diego Chargers This will probably be the last time all season the Chargers are favored. This should be a great game, but I'll give my boys the benefit of the doubt. THE PICK: San Diego 10. New York Jets at Cincinnati Bengals Another great game. Over-achievers at under-achievers. THE PICK: Cincinnati 11. St. Louis Rams at Oakland Raiders Now that Oakland has lost games in every possible way in existance, they should start winning. THE PICK: Oakland 12. Philadelphia Eagles at Minnesota Vikings Quite possibly the game of the week. The Viks have shown incredible grit, though. THE PICK: Minnesota 13. San Francisco 49ers at Carolina Panthers Ericksson isn't that frightening this year. THE PICK: San Francisco Off-week: AFC East (Buffalo Bills Indianapolis Colts Miami Dolphins New England Patriots) Rykor Corral [Dead Sea Bottom] 100 messages oto ew nter ngoto elp Rykor Corral>